View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
Tom Coughlan
Joined: 18 Jan 2005 Posts: 60 Location: Dublin
|
Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 5:14 pm Post subject: Townlands of Tawnagh More and Tooman on Tithe Books |
|
|
I've been unable to find the above 2 townlands on the Tithe Applotment Books for Cloone, although both are in Cloone Civil Parish. Perhaps they were not included. Perhaps they were included under another civil parish? Or were included under other names or as subparts of other townlands? Any leads appreciated.
Many thanks.
Tom |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Andrew Garrick
Joined: 25 Feb 2007 Posts: 15 Location: Northumberland, UK
|
Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2007 4:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I can't help with the specifics of Cloone parish, but I had the same problem in Killinvoy parish (Longnamuck TL). I found the relevant entries included under the neighbouring townland.
The Griffiths valuators used the new "standard" townlands from 1851. The people doing the Tithe Books seem to have been local people, and called the townlands whatever the landlord called them (no doubt they got much of the information from them).
While it isn't 100% reliable, I found I could confirm this by comparing the acreage of the townlands in Griffiths and the equivalent acreage of the townlands in the Tithe Books. You have to allow for the fact the Tithe books are in Irish Acres and the Griffiths survey is in Statute Acres (ratio of 31:49, with each Irish Acre being bigger). In fact, I even found I could correlate quite a few of the individual holdings this way. Apparently, names change in 30 years, but the size of the fields doesn't!
Hope that helps |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Andrew Garrick
Joined: 25 Feb 2007 Posts: 15 Location: Northumberland, UK
|
Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2007 4:48 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I can't help with the specifics of Cloone parish, but I had the same problem in Killinvoy parish (Longnamuck TL). I found the relevant entries included under the neighbouring townland (Galey).
The Griffiths valuators used the new "standard" townlands from 1851. The people doing the Tithe Books seem to have been local people, and called the townlands whatever the landlord called them (no doubt they got much of the information from them).
While it isn't 100% reliable, I found I could confirm this by comparing the acreage of the townlands in Griffiths and the equivalent acreage of the townlands in the Tithe Books. You have to allow for the fact the Tithe books are in Irish Acres and the Griffiths survey is in Statute Acres (ratio of 31:49, with each Irish Acre being bigger).
So you may want to check for them under neighbouring townlands, especially those held by the same landlord.
Hope that helps |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Tom Coughlan
Joined: 18 Jan 2005 Posts: 60 Location: Dublin
|
Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2007 3:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
Andrew,
many thanks for the reply. I did carry out some cursory checks on adjoining townlands, but this was on a hit-and-miss basis. Now that you've confirmed a precedent, I'll try a more structured approach.
Tom. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Jim Irvine
Joined: 14 Jan 2005 Posts: 59 Location: Liverpool, England
|
Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 5:51 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I'm sure this question has come up before but I can't find where. All I can suggest is checking the tithe books for Mohill as both townlands adjoin that parish. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Tom Coughlan
Joined: 18 Jan 2005 Posts: 60 Location: Dublin
|
Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 6:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Thanks Jim, I think it may well come to that. From another tip I got today, it appears that there's at least one Mohill townland (Tamlaght More) on the Cloone Tithe books, so the reverse is very possible. If I manage to get a solution on this, I'll post here, as it could be of general use.
Tom |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Jim Irvine
Joined: 14 Jan 2005 Posts: 59 Location: Liverpool, England
|
Posted: Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:23 am Post subject: |
|
|
By the way, I don't know where you are looking but for reference Susan Dailey has put images of the Cloone Tithe books on Pat Connor's site at
http://www.rootsweb.com/~irllet/records.htm |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Tom Coughlan
Joined: 18 Jan 2005 Posts: 60 Location: Dublin
|
Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 7:28 am Post subject: |
|
|
Mystery solved at last.
Leitrim County Library in Ballinamore holds copies of the Tithe Books for Leitrim, sorted into one book per Civil Parish. Though these appear to be paper printouts from microfilm, the Library has added its own index to the start of each book.
The missing Tooman townland is easily disposed of - the index for Cloone T.A.B. listingTooman under Thomond. There are 4 Thomonds, and I didn't check which one(s) might include Tooman.
Tawnagh More is more challenging! It's not referenced in the index to the Cloone T.A.B. But the Library has copies of O'Donovan's Name Books. O'Donovan's notes on Tawnagh More say it is "entered on the plan" as Tawlaghtmore, and records this is a known alternative name for the townland. This is also the name of a townland in Mohill C.P..
Back on the Cloone T.A.B. I found not Tawlaghmtore but Towlaghtmore, which would be pronounced much the same. Though I didn't find the name sought on Towlaghtmore Tithe page, there were two other names that were listed in Tawnagh More that also appear on Griffith: William Costello and MIchael Wisely. This is the only Wisely household shown in Leitrim on Griffith. I also know that Wiselys live today in Tawnaghmore. Overall then, I think it very likely that this entry of Towlaghtmore on the Tithe books is for what shortly afterwards became named as the townland of Tawnagh More.
As Jim Irvine pointed out, Pat COnnor's site on Rootsweb contains the Cloone Tithe book images. The Towlaghtmore URL : http://www.rootsweb.com/~irllet/records/167.JPG
Tom |
|
Back to top |
|
|
|